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Turkish GP - Penalties

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1 Turkish GP - Penalties on 9th July 2013, 12:23 am

Penalties for the Turkish GP.

Penalties:


Filip Jovic vs Joao - Lap 2, T6 - bump - 5 place grid drop penalty to Filip in the South African GP

Filip Jovic vs Bober_Belarus - Lap 9, T1 - Filip was lapped, slows down too much there and caused a collision with another driver - 10 place grid drop penalty to Filip Jovic

As soon as any driver is being lapped, that specific driver must allow the driver behind overtake as soon as possible in the next safe opportunity to do not endanger his and the other driver(s) race.

4.3 At no time may a car be driven unnecessarily slowly, erratically or in a manner which could be deemed potentially dangerous to other drivers or any other person. This will apply whether any such car is being driven on the track, the pit entry or the pit lane.

(Filip Jovic - 15 place grid drop penalty for the South African GP )

Gatis_Stalshans - Lap 3, T10-11 - Unsafe rejoin to track causing another driver to lose 1 position - 5 place grid drop penalty to Gatis_Stalshans in the South African GP

For incidents involving drivers on different laps or when rejoining the circuit (from off track or pits):
Causing loss of time/position - Stop and Go - 10 place grid drop since he didn't finish the race

Warnings:

Sexy Brigadeiro - Lap 1, Last corner - Sexy does half spin to turn his car, Arnold has to brake to avoid, very close, dangerous maneuver - WARNING to Sexy Brigadeiro

For incidents involving drivers on different laps or when rejoining the circuit (from off track or pits):
Illegal action not affecting other drivers - No Action, Warning or Drive Through
   

Bober_Belarus vs Arnoldinhu - Lap 29, T7 - bump - After the collision Bober waited for Arnold so - WARNING to Bober_Belarus

16. Code of conduct
If you do cause a collision, please allow the driver to retake his place within one lap, and you will only receive a warning. Do not attempt to do this on the opening lap however as this can be dangerous.
Arek - chatting in race - WARNING to Arek

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2 Re: Turkish GP - Penalties on 9th July 2013, 7:09 am

Guest


Guest
You guys can give a warning to my ass next time!

I actuallly MOVED MY CAR OUT OF THE RACING LINE as soon as I saw a gap between the groups of cars.

I did NOT hit ANYone and it couldn't be a 'REjoin', since I never left the track.

I spun and MOVED MY CAR OUT OF THE RACING LINE AS FAST AS I COULD to AVOID a possible crash and to PRESERVE the other drivers... - you guys should CONGRATULATE ME for doing that in a clean way and thinking in the OTHER DRIVERS, even when I was the one fucked up in that situation!

GREAT JOB, gentlemen.

VERY fair and wise - keep it up!

3 Re: Turkish GP - Penalties on 9th July 2013, 7:50 am

Guest


Guest
- "Arnold has to brake to avoid..."

HOW MANY TIMES in a race we have to 'brake to avoid' a possible collision/accident?! It can be for LOTS of reasons... because people lost the control of their cars momentarily.. because they took a corner wrong (entry, middle or exit), because they stepped a kerb and lost too much speed right in front of you and you had too little time to react, because they braked too much/too early, because they bumped another car in front of them and also lost speed suddenly because of that - or even spun, like it happened to me... And I NEVER saw ANYone get a penalty only because we 'had to brake'... - I mean, Arnold didn't lose ANY time (that was REALLY prejudicial to him) or places with that - he only braked (a little bit) because he thought in passing me from the outside while at the same time I was trying to move out from the racing line, since THAT was a REALLY dangerous place for my car to be. In the end, NO ONE was 'hurt' (but me) in ANY ways! I already lost time with that and now I'm ALSO getting a penalty (warning) for it?!?!?! Do I REALLY DESERVE it?!?!?! Is it FAIR?!?!?!

And as I said before, I actually moved my car out of the racing line - because after I spun, that's EXACTLY where my car 'stopped' - EXACTLY on the racing line, in the appex of the corner. THAT was a dangerous spot for me to 'leave my car' and THAT would force the drivers to brake and swerve so they wouldn't hit me. Should I've just left my car 'parked' there until the very last car has passed?! I saw a gap between the group of cars (it's SO EASY to see my first reaction was to turn my car immediately, but then I BRAKED and WAITED for Sven and Gatis to pass (WATCH THE COCKPIT CAM, from MY OWN REPLAY - ANALIZE THE INCIDENT MORE CAREFULLY!!!) and only AFTER that - with a gap until the next group of cars, led by Arnie - it was when I finally moved my car (to MY left/their right), so I could take it OUT of the racing line - HOW could you guys not 'see' and UNDERSTAND what I did there?!?!?!? WHY didn't you guys just at least TALKED TO ME about it all and/or just ASKED ME why I did that or what really happened there, instead of just 'assuming' I was doing some reckless and dangerous move and then 'automatically' penalizing me for that!?!?!?!)... And then I had enough time to move my car from that dangerous spot (If I hadn't, Arnie would've hit me - but he didn't...) and 'clear' the racing line and track for the guys coming from behind to pass - and that's EXACTLY what I did and EXACTLY what happened! I HELPED the guys coming from behind, instead of putting them in danger - they should THANK ME for that (including the stewards), but instead I was 'penalized', even if only with a stupid-ass warning...

- "when rejoining the circuit (from off track or pits)"

I NEVER 'RE-joined' the circuit (from off track - or pits), because I NEVER LEFT the circuit (track)!

...

NOTHING could be more absurd than this warning - I don't care if it affected my race result or not. I'm not complaining about the warning itself (although I COMPLETELY disagree with it and although I'm mad for having it on my 'driver's licence records' - UNFAIRLY). I'm complaining about this 'weird will' in ALWAYS trying to find something 'wrong' with my race(s) and then making them 'not clean' ones, giving me some REALLY UNdeserved (and UNFAIR) penalties - It's REALLY just a HUGE BULLSHIT to 'penalize' me because of things like that - your own arguments to give me this warning, for example, already shows how WRONG and UNFAIR it was - PQP!!!

IMPOSSIBLE not to get mad with some actions (ALWAYS EXCESSIVELY punitive) from the stewards...
Facehand

4 Re: Turkish GP - Penalties on 9th July 2013, 11:20 am

Sexy, you make some good points (such as it not being a rejoin), but it's a really tough call in my opinion.

In actual F1 I think the penalty would be fair because it is usually safer to just stay stationary instead of being a moving target. Here's an example of what happens in real F1 that could have quite easily happened in your situation if Arnie was another, more aggressive driver (of which our league has lots) and didn't slow down.


The problem is that in the league, many drivers will take the racing line even if there is a stationary car parked on it. Some drivers in the league think that they can drive straight through other cars, and in that case there would have been a very serious pile up if you didn't move off the racing line.

So from my judgement, yes, it was a dangerous maneuver, but it would have potentially been even more dangerous if you stayed there. I would call it a racing incident.






Team "Grande" Pet Shark

"I don't need another novel..." - Mike Henry Jr
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5 Re: Turkish GP - Penalties on 9th July 2013, 12:47 pm

Guest


Guest
I don't know why Joe has put those details on your warning in the opening post because they are not correct and they are not why you received a warning for this incident Sexy. It is not about rejoining.

It is because you did a half spin, wildly and dangerously (in our opinion), to turn your car to face the right way. It was in our opinion a reckless move and if the timing had been slightly different it could have caused a big collision.

Luckily Arnold just managed to avoid you, but it was through luck. Arnold could not possibly read that situation.

If you were trying to move your car from the racing line the safe option would have been to either

a) Drive straight in the direction you were facing with no spin off the track, or to the track limits (quickly removing your car from danger)
b) Reverse backwards and towards the pit wall, off the racing line
c) Remain stationary allowing other drivers to decide a evasive maneuver around you

These would have removed your car from the line relatively safely.

As it is, you drove in the direction you were facing, but spun the car around, meaning that you didn't move out of danger at all (car moved maybe 1 car width from original position), but increased the danger by creating an unreadable situation for the other drivers and also increasing the profile of your car to the oncoming traffic.

You have not been penalised, you have been warned about spinning your car in a dangerous manner, and that it was wrong in the stewards' interpretation of the league rules. Don't do it like this again, and then there is no problem.

6 Re: Turkish GP - Penalties on 9th July 2013, 7:24 pm

Guest


Guest
As I said before and as Adrian mentioned... I acted based in what I 'assumed' it could happen if I had stayed on the racing line, so my natural reaction was "I gotta get my car/myself out of here as soon as I have a chance!"... As soon as I spun, I tried to turn my car to the right direction and get out of there, but then I saw Sven and Gatis coming.. Then I just braked and waited for them to pass (this can be easily seen from my cockpit/TV cam - at least on my own replay, with no lags or anything) and then, keeping that "I gotta get my car/myself out of here as soon as I have a chance!" thought on my mind, I saw a gap from Gatis to the next group of cars (led by Arnie) and then I though that was more than enough time for me to move out of the racing line without harming anyone - and that's what happened: no one was harmed (and I don't think it was 'luck' by Arnie. He had time enough to brake and avoid me and that didn't prejudiced his race at all - as I mentioned before, there are lots of situations in the race where we have to brake and avoid other cars in front of us and these cars are never penalized for that - which would also be an absurd (to penalize them), of course).

So... what bothered me the most was to get a penalty (warning) for a 'dangerous/reclkess action', when I was actually THINKING ON THE OTHER DRIVERS and taking the best and safest sollution I could find.
I know you guys can list a zillion of other actions I could've/should've taken, but still the fact is that NO ONE was harmed (not even Arnie) and it was NOT a 'reckless' move, since I was actually doing it THINKING ON THE OTHERS...

So, jah... I still think it was an unfair punishment (especially also because no one but ME actually had their race prejudiced with all of that - even if the very first spin was a personal mistake by myself).

But anyway... Nothing's gonna change the veredict and I won't keep crying about it. I already said everything I wanted and tried to 'prove' why I am innocent and shouldn't have been penalized.

I'm done with the discussions on this subject. Let's move on.

7 Re: Turkish GP - Penalties on 9th July 2013, 7:49 pm

Guest


Guest
It doesn't matter what you were thinking or trying to do, the only thing that matters is what you did and the consequences of that.

You are correct that nobody was hurt, and that is why you are just being warned about it. You are not being punished.

You are being warned not to do something like this again. So if you don't do something like this again, then it will not matter.

The warning system is different this season.

Also saying that we don't punish situations that force other drivers to brake is confused. You take it out of context by saying that. It's about a rejoin, or in this case, a turning move (I don't know what to call it), THAT CAUSED another drive to stop/slow/swerve.

Of course making another driver stop/slow/swerve is not a punishable thing in of itself, but it's the actions that lead to those reactions.

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